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Geography lessons required at the Guardian!

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
The Guardian has an article on "affordable skiing holidays with a difference". One of the holidays is skiing with Eddie the Eagle which apparently takes place in Courchevel Moriond, in Serre Chevalier Wonderfull piece of well researched and proof read journalism Very Happy Very Happy
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
@tarrantd, The Grauniad is (in)famous for not proofreading. I suspect they can’t afford to employ them Very Happy
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
@tarrantd, 😆 they’ll be telling us you can ski Lac de Tignes with Eric the Eel next.
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Rabbie wrote:
@tarrantd, The Grauniad is (in)famous for not proofreading. I suspect they can’t afford to employ them Very Happy


Quite possibly genuinely true.
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Employing proofreaders? It’s called spellchecker. It comes free with the word processor. rolling eyes

As “secretary” disappearing as job titles, the sort of things that got dumped on the rest of the staff got done half-heartedly. Even head of states end up with laughable mistakes!

A newspaper without proofreader is nothing compared to that.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
I may be wrong but didn't the BBC recently give figures for food discarded as waste that had every man woman and child in the UK throwing away 2 litres of milk every day.

However the bit that really annoys me is the Sunday Times (I know it is an American newspaper with an elderly readership). Last week they had a special skiing section and the very first article was on developments in la rossiere. Then it gives the heights in feet! After searching for my calculator for a while to convert these to British units I have up and tossed the whole supplement in the bin. I have no idea what was in the rest of the supplement.
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Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
@johnE, A wise move for your own sanity (and sense of reality) Madeye-Smiley
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
They recognise talent though 😉

My 'reader's tip' on Madesimo netted me £200 worth of hotel.com vouchers 👍
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Surely everyone works in feet?
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Ski the Net with snowHeads
twoodwar wrote:
Surely everyone works in feet?


Not any more. Metres (height) and kilometres (distance) are the new norm, particularly amongst the young.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
@twoodwar, I reckon anyone who first went to school after about 1985 can probably at best convert to feet but will more naturally think in metres.
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
telford_mike wrote:
twoodwar wrote:
Surely everyone works in feet?


Not any more. Metres (height) and kilometres (distance) are the new norm, particularly amongst the young.
I'm a jumble of metric and imperial: altitude is metres; height of a person feet+inches; weight is kilograms, except for humans which is stones+pounds; cold temperature is Centigrade, hot temperature is Fahrenheit; length is metres, distance is miles. Think its the result of growing up during the transition of imperial to metric, plus experience since then in different countries (mainly Euopean for metric and USA for imperial).
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 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
rob@rar wrote:
telford_mike wrote:
twoodwar wrote:
Surely everyone works in feet?


Not any more. Metres (height) and kilometres (distance) are the new norm, particularly amongst the young.
I'm a jumble of metric and imperial: altitude is metres; height of a person feet+inches; weight is kilograms, except for humans which is stones+pounds; cold temperature is Centigrade, hot temperature is Fahrenheit; length is metres, distance is miles. Think its the result of growing up during the transition of imperial to metric, plus experience since then in different countries (mainly Euopean for metric and USA for imperial).


Yep, except growing up hiking in the Lakes and doing a fair amount of skiing in US I also am used to altitude in ft. We're aiming to climb an 800m mountain today kids isn't quite as inspirational. I quite like thinking about road distances in miles. Always makes Euro drives a lot shorter wink
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
I think anyone with an education mainly in the science subjects will be have been exposed to both. I went to secondary school in the mid 60s, so remember the wide use of imperial measures, but a large portion of my education used SI units, so I’m happy with those too. I’m also very familiar with old currency too as I was 17 two days before decimalisation!
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Gämsbock wrote:
@twoodwar, I reckon anyone who first went to school after about 1985 can probably at best convert to feet but will more naturally think in metres.

I’d agree with this, though as @rob@rar says, it’s still a bit of a jumble for me. I struggle to picture how tall say 178cm is, where as I have a better idea of 5’9”, but if you want me to tell you which skis to get, I need your height in cm! Just familiarity I think. I need metres for mountains, too, or I’ve got no idea. I switched to working distances in km due to local units, have no idea how to weigh in anything other than kg, and would never use Fahrenheit.

Last week my mother tried to convince me that her house was at 1000m (we were 2000m up Nordkette at the time...). As she lives at the low end of the Peak District, I suggested her units may be a little out Laughing
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Gämsbock wrote:
@twoodwar, I reckon anyone who first went to school after about 1985 can probably at best convert to feet but will more naturally think in metres.


I went to school in 1969 and it was metric then (in Bournemouth). I have no idea what a foot, perch, bushel, stone or whatever is.
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Quote:

altitude is metres;

hill and mountains, yes, cos that's what's on every map
flight altitude is feet, cos that's what's used in the international standard flight level

Quote:

weight is kilograms, except for humans which is stones+pounds;

lived in mainland EU for too long, and only time I quote my weight is in the ski rental shop, so that's kg now too

Quote:

cold temperature is Centigrade, hot temperature is Fahrenheit;

cold is celcius, hot is celcius, really frickin' cold is Kelvin (I'd have to do mental arithmetic to convert 132K into normal temperatures, or more commonly type it in to google)

started school in '76. I've only ever done metric. My grandmother did everything in metric (due to living overseas), and had metric kitchen scales, etc.
I know people that convert every petrol price in to £ per gallon, that are younger than me. They've never been taught gallons, the last gallon we might have ever seen is what orange squash came in (the tartrazine laden stuff) in the 70's, and petrol pumps have been 100% metric since before we both ever filled a car tank when doing driving lessons.

the only imperial I ever came across doing science/engineering is when you get stuff like 0.1" pitch on (ye olde) circuit boards, imperial sizes on RF connectors etc. (actually lots of round things are imperial but labeled in metric but aren't). although getting a tape recorder with a tape length in miles, tensions in ounce force, speed in IPS,... that was an interesting one. But then who cares what the units are? you just have to keep the numbers with the limits.

Quote:

I’m also very familiar with old currency too as I was 17 two days before decimalisation!

Fortunately I was born just after decimal day. Have a few farthings somewhere in the random coin collection pot. They might be worth something one day Wink
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
The reason people convert petrol prices is because we buy petrol in litres, measure journeys in miles and quote fuel consumption in either miles per gallon or litres per 100k.

Like most who went to school prior to decimalisation I have a very mixed use of units depending on what I'm talking about or who I'm talking too. Converting in to cm is second nature because clothes come from all over the world and China often uses inches for the American market.

I do get frustrated when my SatNav knows I'm on the continent and starts quoting distance in Km while my car is still recording everything in miles!
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I remember being in junior school being told that there were 2 scales for temperature: farenheight and centegrade (I realise that this has been replaced by celcius) and that farenheight was the old fashioned unit and was being phased out. That was in 1959. I have never used farenheight in my life.

In senior school we used 3 sets of units: feet, pounds and seconds; centimetres, grams and seconds and metres, kilograms and seconds. When I went to university in 1970 the UK had gone metric and the SI system was implemented completely. I've never used the other units since.

Quote:

Quote:
altitude is metres;
hill and mountains, yes, cos that's what's on every map

I beleive this was decided at the first International Geographical Congress, held in Antwerp in 1871.
@twoodwar, I believe "Surely everyone works in feet?" should be "Surely everyone walks on feet?"
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
andy wrote:
But then who cares what the units are? you just have to keep the numbers with the limits.



Agreed, but it's a good idea to stick to one set of units and not mix them up, as NASA found out to their cost with their Mars Climate Orbiter, but I'm sure you knew all about that! wink
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I enjoyed listening to my builders crunching mms and inches last week. They got everything right, too!
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
@johnE, I was born in ‘85 but work in the building industry so often refer to inches for smaller sizes (usually anything up to about 10 inch). In fact I always find it strange that people will happily ask for something like a 3m length of 2x2.
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
For design work, I work in mm or pixels, but get the occasional US client who can only supply inches. I always convert to mm even though my software can use both, otherwise it ends up calculating decimal inches, which is enough to explode my brain Confused

We have SI units. Why do some people insist on not using them?!

And don’t get me started on column “inches”... rolling eyes
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
@SnoodlesMcFlude, reminded me of an incident at a wood yard a few years ago. We went in to buy some moulding for the back door, three pieces measured up in metres, plus a bit to trim to size. Getting them cut meant they would fit in the car. “No problem,” he said, as we handed over the measurements. “Is it for a door?” Thinking they guy was simply interested in our DIY attempts, we told him yes, he had deduced correctly.

When we returned an hour later with the two pieces that were about 5cm too short, he simply shook his head and remarked that we should’ve told him it was a big door rolling eyes
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rob@rar wrote:
I'm a jumble of metric and imperial: .....


Same - I order timber at 4.8m of 4*2 (inches). My jeans are imperial. My shoes are imperial. I can fix your roof in inches or mm but I'm not entirely sure if the 100mm soil will fit through the 4 inch hole I just drilled.....or maybe it is the other way around. One of them definitely isn't 4 inches. Laughing Laughing
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 snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
4” is a tad bigger than 100mm.

Pity those of us immigrated from the larger part of the world that’s nothing but metric, dumped into the imperial world! What the freaking hell is a gallon! Worse yet, Fahrenheit??? Shocked

At least between kg and pounds, the conversion is relatively straight forward. My parents were civil engineers. I can only imagine their struggles adapting to imperial units at work. I was young enough, so I ended up reasonably comfortable in both.
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
@abc, Civil Engineering has been entirely SI in the UK since the early 1970s. Unless your parents were working in the UK before 1970 they would not have come across imperial units. I'm not really sure what happens in the USA - they may have their own unit system.

Perhaps I am too young to be comfortable in Imperial units
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 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
Working in military aviation engineering in the 80s the airframes were metric but the engines were imperial. Had two sets of tools and knew which could be used on both (not many). Amazing more things didn't go wrong and that things actually lined up.
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
Quote:

I'm not really sure what happens in the USA - they may have their own unit system.

They certainly get short changed on their gallons and pints compared to our "mansize" ones Wink
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
@abc, but is that an Imperial or Metric tad?Of course, if you'd have said 'Smidge' then we'd all know you were working in Whitworth.
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@SnoodlesMcFlude, 4x2 doesn't actually measure 4"X2" so I think of it more as a name. As a structural engineer I often talk with builders about 4x2 but always put 100x50 (nominal) on my drawings!
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Tyres are a great mix of units:

The width is in mm
The height is a % of the width
the diameter is given in inches
Load index which is sequential ( though non-linear ) numbers
Then you have the speed rating which are non-sequential series of letters
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
@abc, Fahrenheit is what they give the temperature in in US weather forecasts. A gallon is the unit used when buying petrol(gas) in the USA. Just to complicate things the US gallon is a bit smaller than the Imperial Gallon as formerly used in the UK.
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@leggyblonde, it doesn’t measure 100x50 either Wink Best not to get me started on designers and measurements at the minute...
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
johnE wrote:
.....the bit that really annoys me is the Sunday Times ...special skiing section and the very first article was on developments in la rossiere.


Ironic, really Toofy Grin
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Rabbie wrote:
@abc, Fahrenheit is what they give the temperature in in US weather forecasts. A gallon is the unit used when buying petrol(gas) in the USA. Just to complicate things the US gallon is a bit smaller than the Imperial Gallon as formerly used in the UK.


@abc probably knows this as she lives in the US

Richard_Sideways wrote:
@abc, but is that an Imperial or Metric tad? Of course, if you'd have said 'Smidge' then we'd all know you were working in Whitworth.


Laughing Laughing
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Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
johnE wrote:
@abc, Civil Engineering has been entirely SI in the UK since the early 1970s. Unless your parents were working in the UK before 1970 they would not have come across imperial units. I'm not really sure what happens in the USA - they may have their own unit system.

Perhaps I am too young to be comfortable in Imperial units

Mid-70's.

Building materials were still in Imperial units, if I recall correctly. Also, size of rooms were still being referred to as "square feet"! Shocked Fortunately, the conversion were quite handy. A 4000 "square feet" flat is just... 400 square metre! Toofy Grin
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
[/quote]I'm a jumble of metric and imperial: altitude is metres; height of a person feet+inches; weight is kilograms, except for humans which is stones+pounds; cold temperature is Centigrade, hot temperature is Fahrenheit; length is metres, distance is miles. Think its the result of growing up during the transition of imperial to metric, plus experience since then in different countries (mainly Euopean for metric and USA for imperial).[/quote]

+1 on the above - born in 1970

It made me smile
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
abc wrote:
Also, size of rooms were still being referred to as "square feet"! Shocked Fortunately, the conversion were quite handy. A 4000 "square feet" flat is just... 400 square metre! Toofy Grin


Good try 4000sq ft is only just over 371 sq m. 29sq m is a whole room or an apartment in a French ski resort Very Happy Very Happy
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@SnoodlesMcFlude, 4x2 doesn't actually measure 4"X2" so I think of it more as a name. As a structural engineer I often talk with builders about 4x2 but always put 100x50 (nominal) on my drawings!

It amused me that it's pronounced "four ba two" on sites here. But a friend from USA calls it "two buy four" guess it depends which way it's stacked Very Happy
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