 Poster: A snowHead
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| essex wrote: |
| I would point out the pole tapping is anti boarder 😜 |
As a boarder with no poles, I unfortunately have to go with "HEY YOU F****** C*** SLOW B****** M*****F***** GET OUT OF MY F***** WAY, DO YOU EVEN KNOW WHO I AM?!".
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| T Bar wrote: |
| andy wrote: |
| Don't suddenly appear beside me. Pass with enough space that you can do a check or change your course, in the event that I change mine. Or don't pass. And don't ski on my tails either. |
You can pass at a distance that will not hit someone but can still startle them on most cat tracks.
If you make someone aware of your presence through a noise at a reasonable distance this is less likely to happen, I certainly would not suggest doing it whilst sitting on someone's tails. |
^^This.
Just because I'm beside you doesn't mean that I'm right next to you. I pass where I can change course, generally do so slowly and try not to ski too close to people if I'm behind them. Doesn't mean that I shouldn't give an indication that I'm there. It's not like composite poles make a particularly loud noise, they wouldn't startle a blind granny.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| essex wrote: |
| I would point out the pole tapping is anti boarder 😜 |
Boarders shouldn't be allowed on cat tracks anyway 
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| T Bar wrote: |
| Pruman wrote: |
| Why is everyone skiing on a narrow path? |
Because they have to be taken occasionally on most mountains, wide open pistes you have plenty enough room to never startle anyone if completely unheard. |
Well you never stop learning.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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I am sorry but I just don't at all see the necessity of the pole tap or any other indication that you want to pass. In many years of skiing I have safely passed, and been passed by, other skiers and boarders. I have never come close to colliding with anyone and never felt the need to make a noise before I pass.
In my experience, most pole tappers DO see it as a way of warning slower skiers that they are coming through pretty much regardless. There seems to be a (growing) perception that it is the slower skier who is at fault for being in the way of people who want to go faster. I have had words quite a few times, where my kids are snow-ploughing in a very predictable manner and have been barged (physically) by someone squeezing by at higher speed and running out of room. I have to say it is often, but not always, a snowboarder. I get very cross indeed when said miscreants complain that they were being "held-up" and the kids was taking up "the whole track", so much so that there are a few young boarders, skiers (and worse snow-bladers) who I know for a fact will avoid angry Scottish men for the rest of their lives!
If you can pass safely, so do. If you don't have the skill or space, don't. If you need to pass someone very slowly where you are parallel to them for any length of time you either lack the skill or the room, or more likely are just lacking patience.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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| zikomo wrote: |
there are a few young boarders, skiers (and worse snow-bladers) who I know for a fact will avoid angry Scottish men for the rest of their lives!
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What do you do to them?
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| zikomo wrote: |
I am sorry but I just don't at all see the necessity of the pole tap or any other indication that you want to pass. In many years of skiing I have safely passed, and been passed by, other skiers and boarders. I have never come close to colliding with anyone and never felt the need to make a noise before I pass.
In my experience, most pole tappers DO see it as a way of warning slower skiers that they are coming through pretty much regardless. There seems to be a (growing) perception that it is the slower skier who is at fault for being in the way of people who want to go faster. I have had words quite a few times, where my kids are snow-ploughing in a very predictable manner and have been barged (physically) by someone squeezing by at higher speed and running out of room. I have to say it is often, but not always, a snowboarder. I get very cross indeed when said miscreants complain that they were being "held-up" and the kids was taking up "the whole track", so much so that there are a few young boarders, skiers (and worse snow-bladers) who I know for a fact will avoid angry Scottish men for the rest of their lives!
If you can pass safely, so do. If you don't have the skill or space, don't. If you need to pass someone very slowly where you are parallel to them for any length of time you either lack the skill or the room, or more likely are just lacking patience. |
+1
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| Quote: |
I have had words quite a few times, where my kids are snow-ploughing in a very predictable manner and have been barged (physically) by someone squeezing by at higher speed and running out of room.
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Well I think we know who that might have been eh dp?
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| Quote: |
I am sorry but I just don't at all see the necessity of the pole tap or any other indication that you want to pass.
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As pointed out it can be a courtesy.
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In my experience, most pole tappers DO see it as a way of warning slower skiers that they are coming through pretty much regardless.
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To be honest I do not know thew motives of most peoples actions on the slopes, I am not sure how you determine them.
Some people are badly behaved but in my general view the majority are not and that includes those who declare their presence and those who do not. What their individual motives are I do not know but most peoples actions appear reasonable though some do not. I have seen people jump and startle when passed by skiers when in no actual danger of being hit,(It happened to me recently when a pedestrian on a footpath being overtaken by a cyclist) this is what I personally am trying to avoid.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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If you zero tolerance for alcohol types could maybe put a patch/sticker or something on your jackets that would be good so we know who you are😜
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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I think the point is that the pole tap is a language people don't understand, especially new people who are the ones most likely to be turning more across the path and making slower progress. It doesn't achieve anything other than uncertainty.
Shouting is worse. Training on an athletics track you get some sprinters who shout "track" because they don't want to change lane (even though they are just training). It sends people into confusion because some go one way and others the other and some don't move at all. I've seen loads of comedy pile ups like that.
If everyone just knew the FIS Rules, everything would be OK.
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| Quote: |
It doesn't achieve anything other than uncertainty.
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It is a noise it allows someone to know that there is someone else in the vicinity and they are less likely to be startled by the sudden appearance of someone. It needs no gift of mutual language to know that, if someone cannot work out that someone else is in the area from a human noise then god help them. There are a few people who are deaf and who cannot hear but they generally have greater spatial awareness and pick up non auditory clues of other people.
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You know it makes sense.
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@T Bar, Well there's a whole lotta scraping going on, you know for sure there are people around you already, you have your back to the pole tapper, you probably have a helmet on and diminished hearing, it might be windy, you are hanging on to your back bottom and concentrating on getting down. So you hear a tapping. What exactly are you meant to do with that information?
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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| Pruman wrote: |
| @T Bar, Well there's a whole lotta scraping going on, you know for sure there are people around you already, you have your back to the pole tapper, you probably have a helmet on and diminished hearing, it might be windy, you are hanging on to your back bottom and concentrating on getting down. So you hear a tapping. What exactly are you meant to do with that information? |
Do whatever you want with that information it is entirely up to you, but you are certainly less likely to jump when your passed if you are aware that someone is there.
If you really don't wish to hear anyone else you can always fill your ears with cotton wool, I won't pass you any closer or further as a result but you might get a bit more startled.
PS If there genuinely is a lot of other noise going on I am not going to click my poles or anything else, my purpose is to make people aware of my presence not to harrass them.
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Poster: A snowHead
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@T Bar, what I'd like to do with that information isn't for a family forum. So, hypothetical scenario number 465, you are tapping behind me, I discern that you are on my left so I decide to move over to the right - straight into the path of a non-tapper who also wants to pass. What if everyone is tapping? And then a shouter comes on the scene. How about a fog horn? A conch? It's a nonsense. Just know the FIS Rules.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| T Bar wrote: |
| Quote: |
It doesn't achieve anything other than uncertainty.
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It is a noise it allows someone to know that there is someone else in the vicinity and they are less likely to be startled by the sudden appearance of someone. It needs no gift of mutual language to know that, if someone cannot work out that someone else is in the area from a human noise then god help them. There are a few people who are deaf and who cannot hear but they generally have greater spatial awareness and pick up non auditory clues of other people. |
No-one gets startled by someone passing in control at a safe distance.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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@halfhand, yeah, obviously, people have to actually follow the rules. If everyone did that then we wouldn't be having this debate at all.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Nah people would still lose it in genuine accidents ( perhaps a rental tech failed to adjust forward pressure on a set of bindings causing a pre release) and those who blindly believed in the rules rather than exercising self and environmental awareness would still get hit.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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@Dave of the Marmottes, yeah, but they'd still feel great about being self-righteous on forums 
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@Dave of the Marmottes, accidents are accidents - hitting a hidden rock or a pre-release. Genuine unforseen events. But in the case of a collision, someone is generally at fault and someone is generally the innocent victim. People knowing and acting upon a rather simple set of rules would cut that element of pain down considerably.
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Thing is - anyone can have a fall but the point is you are supposed to ski at a pace and distance that means your fall doesn't result in a collision. If your prerelease means you hit someone then the two skiers started off too close together for their speeds.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Unless it's icy and you slide on your back for 300m and eventually hit someone standing in the middle of the piste 
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Been there and done that. Mouflon above Meribel. The couple I colected laughed as they were struggling with the icy snow too! There are accidents.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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@Scarpa, why not self arrest? Sliding a full 300m is usually avoidable At least sliding along on your back you can still tap your poles I guess.
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| Pruman wrote: |
| @T Bar, what I'd like to do with that information isn't for a family forum. So, hypothetical scenario number 465, you are tapping behind me, I discern that you are on my left so I decide to move over to the right - straight into the path of a non-tapper who also wants to pass. What if everyone is tapping? And then a shouter comes on the scene. How about a fog horn? A conch? It's a nonsense. Just know the FIS Rules. |
Where on earth in the FIS rules does it suggest that you can't state your presence or that it is dangerous to do so.
If you have three people overtaking in different narrow places it is clearly not a place where I am tryign to get through so your scenario doesn't really compute with what I do.
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You know it makes sense.
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| Quote: |
Where on earth in the FIS rules does it suggest that you can't state your presence or that it is dangerous to do so.
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@T Bar, In the Highway Code it doesn't mention many many things but that's not an invitation to make up new rules as I go along is it?
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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| Pruman wrote: |
| Quote: |
Where on earth in the FIS rules does it suggest that you can't state your presence or that it is dangerous to do so.
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@T Bar, In the Highway Code it doesn't mention many many things but that's not an invitation to make up new rules as I go along is it? |
No and I'm not making up any rule, I am stating what I do in the belief that it probably adds in a small way to the safety of everyone, I am not demanding that anyone else does it, just slightly bemused how vehemently opposed some people appear to be to a common behaviour for which I see no rational reason to oppose or why it endangers anyone.
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Poster: A snowHead
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Not opposed. I just don't know what you intend by tapping. And my default assumption seems to be different to your intentions. You seem to be alerting me that you are there. I am assuming there's someone that impatiently wants to force their way thru.
Where in the FIS code does it state to tap (or do anything else) to alert the next skier in front where you are?
So personally, I'd save the effort. I don't need to know if someone is behind me on a cat track. It's a cat track, so most of the time, there usually is.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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@andy,
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Where in the FIS code does it state to tap (or do anything else) to alert the next skier in front where you are?
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It doesn't and I never suggested it does, it can be a good idea or not irrespective of what the FIS rules state, they do not for instance state that your equipment should be well maintained , I don't think too many people would argue against that.
However I am not even trying to say too anyone else what they should do but believe that in my case it adds a little to general safety and I cannot for the life of me see how it detracts from it, if one follows the FIS code.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| Quote: |
I am stating what I do in the belief that it probably adds in a small way to the safety of everyone
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@T Bar, I can't go on. It doesn't add to safety. I need a drink.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| Pruman wrote: |
| Quote: |
I have had words quite a few times, where my kids are snow-ploughing in a very predictable manner and have been barged (physically) by someone squeezing by at higher speed and running out of room.
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Well I think we know who that might have been eh dp? |
All I can think to say is "yawn"
You're more tedious than Japanese water torture
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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wing mirrors for learners/nervous skiers and cow bells for impatient skiers! 
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The pole tap is the equivalent of someone driving right up your back bottom flashing their lights for you to get out of the way despite the fact you are stuck behind a myriad of cars in front of you.
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Or sitting in the over taking lane with their indicator on despite being at the back of a line of cars?
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Maybe they should just fence off a few runs for the 'full contact' guys - L'espace de testosterone. They can have lasers and flashing lights on their helmets, exploding poles and mercury-tipped spikes on their body armour. I'd pay to watch.
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| galpinos wrote: |
| The pole tap is the equivalent of someone driving right up your back bottom flashing their lights for you to get out of the way despite the fact you are stuck behind a myriad of cars in front of you. |
No, it's the equivalent of indicating before you overtake on a single carriageway road. Your analogy works if you use pole tap on a wide piste to get people to move.
@Pruman, you're one of those 'black and white' type people aren't you? The type that conclude someone's a terrorist because they go to a self serve checkout and put through a croissant as a bread roll to save 50p
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FAQ
